The thing I wonder is "How much of an impact does a 'Hitting Coach' really have at the major league-level? I mean really, what is Hal (or any hitting coach) going to tell these guys?

Coach: "Hey Scotty, try to not popout so often."

Rolen: "Aaaah dammit....you're right. My bad."

or

Coach: "Hey Lil' David, you're the leadoff hitter...try to get on base more often, will ya?"

Eck: "Thanks dude, I forgot about that."

What does the hitting coach really do here? I'm sure he tries to look at what each guy is doing and pick up no any quirks in his swing that might contribute to an abundance of groundouts/popups/etc, but beyond that, what is his role?

Would this club react the same way?  Or do some of the players actually blame tlr/dunc/wj/hal or someone else?

But it would be nice if some veterans would rise up indignant and proclaim that getting the ring and/or a contract extension does not mean they are looking for early retirement.

If they can't play, let them sit.  If you need room for the replacements, put them on the DL and don't dress'em up.  If they don't like that, then somebody might have to go DFA.

Send Hal to Springfield or Memphis.  Do something.  If they can't become base runners, don't make Oquendo stand out there until they do.  Tell the bat boy to sit down, and let the players get there own shit until they proove they know what to do with it.  Make non-hitters return to the far end of the dug out.  Anything to piss somebody off enough to rip the cover off the ball.

Reminds me of the Mets back up catcher, Junior Ortiz, who was having terrible problems in '84 hitting. Turns out he was wearing contac lenses, but no one had ever instructed him how, or even told him that he had to clean the little suckers, and they were all gummed up and encrusted ... like trying to see through a coke bottle.

Is there something to learn in all this?

I think the issue could be Rolen, though.  He has never forgiven LaRussa for benching him and he's taking the team down with him. I think Edmunds was talking about Scotty.   If that's the case, then he needs to go -- can't let it metastasize.  Wouldn't be the first time LaRussa couldn't handle the ego of a star player.  

At any rate, it's been a great run and if this is the start of a restructuring then I'm happy to start with Carp, Mulder, Looper, Reyes and Wainwright next year and a new starting 7 plus Pujols.

More to your point though-
I don't know if I agree with your hitting coach = pitching coach theory. You never really hear about a hitting coach "working wonders" with a guy or "successfully reviving a reclamation project." Maybe it's because we have a highly regarded pitching coach but their respective roles aren't publicized to the same degree, which makes it seem like the hitting coach has a smaller role.

So you're saying that the "hitting coach does have things to do"....okay then. So is it that Hal isn't doing those things?

"These are major league hitters, and good ones at that.  Talent is not destroyed by poor coaching."

That was my original point about "What does the hitting coach do anyway". And I think your take is right-on about bringing in someone else, even though I think his (or "her" in the spirit of equal opportunity) role is relatively minor in the larger scheme of things.

Basically, if something is extremely bad in one area, then the person in charge of said area should probably take some heat and if that means losing his job, so be it.

[...]

The point of a hitting coach is to give hitters outside input into what may be going on with their swings.  If your current coach isn't coming up with answers, someone with a fresh outlook could be the answer.  

Hal McRae's job is to be the 'fail safe' against 200 AB slumps for a hitter.  He is supposed to work with them to find what the flaw is in their current approach and fix it.  A major league hitting coach is like a golf 'swing coach'.  If their current method has stopped working or they aren't getting the results they want, then give them an alternative.

The 'keep chopping wood' approach this team apparently has at the plate isn't working.  Edmonds has changed his swing over the past week, and has seen better results.  Pujols nor Rolen have made any significant changes.

If Pujols isn't able to catch up to high fastballs, then he should go back to standing up taller.  DON'T have him move his hands down, or else he will have more pop ups.  Have him stand up taller and swing down on the ball or through it.

Something I have noticed as that since the Milwaukee series, Chris Duncan has picked up a 'tick'.  Maybe I had never noticed it before, but he is using his front foot as a 'timer' moving it before the pitch reaches the plate.  I hadn't ever noticed this before.  If it is something new, perhaps it explains his current 1 for 20 or so stretch.

Hal McRae's job is to make sure these massive slumps don't happen.  Much like Tony's job is to make sure the team doesn't lose/puts them in the best position to win.  Hal McRae isn't doing his job.

If Tony LaRussa currently had the team winning at a .185 - .225 percentage, he'd be fired.  That is what is McRae's 'winning percentage' is right now.

As for the trade idea, I'm intrigued, almost as much by Bernie's posting it as anything. We'd gain badly needed youth and a good OF bat.

One downside: Much as we need production from the OF now, longer term, that's probably not one of the biggest needs.  I might take my chances in 2010 with Duncan, Rasmus and some combination of Ankiel, Jay, Mather and Julio Franco as a free-agent acquisition. It's the infield where the cupboard is truly bare.

The only way those 3 help the Cardinals is if they are repackaged in a deal for Cabrera or someone like that.

Ethier is 25 and really hasn't shown that he is anything better than a 4th outfielder.  He has never exhibited much power.

Betemit is also 25 and is even worse.  In his 2000+ minor league ABs he batted .279 with 56 HRs.  He's very bad defensively and honestly would hopefully be a backup for this team and Scott Spiezio would get the start.

Kemp could be a decent CF in the future, however he is 23 years old.  He would be blocking Colby Rasmus in the very near future, certainly when he reaches his prime seasons.  Kemps major asset is his speed but a major concern is his strikeouts.

I dunno, I would hope that for Scott Rolen we could get a slightly better deal than this.

I hope Walt doesn't panic and pull the trigger on this.

i don't think this season is of titanic proportions...yet, but the encrapcion signing is exactly what we get when we pull the trigger on deals that might make the team slightly better under the right conditions.  

there's something to be said for potentially getting some value for rolen if we've now seen his offensive zenith.  i'm not willing to believe that both he and pujols won't come around.  edmonds otoh - toast.

let's remember, the nl champion 2005 houston astros were 9-13 at the end of april and 19-32 a the end of may.  they were outscored during that 2 month period to the tune of 229 - 182.  while they had the advantage of one roger clemens' arrival, their offense was nearly as inept as ours currently is.  that included ensberg, berkman and biggio.  part of what they did was simply wait through some strong players extended slumps.  we need to do the same.

if they can pull the trigger on a tejada, a hunter, a a. jones, i'd take it, but betemit or ethier - how do they make this team better than it is right now, or will be?

Almost makes you think the Card's shouldn't even show up.....oh wait, that's what they've been doing.

If Pujols were on his game, we'd all be a lot calmer.  Hopefully, that comes soon.  

Mike Myers?

I just cant think of anyone else...
IM probibly missing something.  I suppose Tino counts? But he was horrible and never really bounced back