community projection results: edmonds
Update [2007-2-16 17:48:28 by lboros]: kip wells community projection is up. [end update]
the edmonds numbers in a moment. first, a few housekeeping items:
- still time to fill out a sim tournament bracket; send it to Cardinal70 at cardinal70@gmail.com.
- and if haven't yet entered Valatan's preseason contest, i've reopened the comments in that thread. as a spam-combatting measure, comments are automatically closed one week after posting; i've manually lifted the ban, so you can go back and post your entries if you want. i'll leave that open until february 28, when the first spring training game is played.
- speaking of which: i've posted a general solicitation for in-person reportage from spring training. if you're down there for any length of time --- a day, a week, whatever --- and feel like sharing your impressions with the VEB community, post a diary or e-mail me at vivaelbirdos@yahoo.com.
- jeff sackmann of the Hardball Times has posted his rankings of the big-league farm systems; he's got the cardinals on the rise at #23, a nice change from the days when every rater put st louis in the bottom two or three. Baseball Prospectus' kevin goldstein had the cards at #27 the other day; even that represents an improvement.
- speaking of sackmann, an SB Nation colleague (Brew Crew Ball) and the creator of the indispensable Minor League Splits --- he's launching a new site, College Splits, that promises college-baseball data in greater detail than you've ever seen. the site should be fully functional by june's amateur draft --- and, given the cardinals' heavy emphasis on college draftees in recent years, College Splits could be a valuable tool. keep an eye on it.
- last preliminary: charlie wilmoth, VEB's SB Nation blog brother at Bucs Dugout, has a cogent preview of the cardinals; worth a look.
| AB | AVG | OBP | SLG | HR | RBI | R | |||
| 07 proj | 425 | .272 | .373 | .503 | 25 | 86 | 79 | ||
| 06 act'l | 350 | .257 | .350 | .471 | 19 | 70 | 52 |
and here's the range in each category:
| AB | AVG | OBP | SLG | HR | RBI | R | |||
| high | 500 | .315 | .460 | .588 | 32 | 112 | 105 | ||
| low | 340 | .249 | .320 | .398 | 17 | 62 | 52 | ||
| 2006 | 350 | .257 | .350 | .471 | 19 | 70 | 52 |
only the most pessimistic among us sees edmonds' numbers continuing to decline; as a community, we are almost certain that 2006 was the bottom of the barrel for edmonds. i got curious and decided to check the percentage of individuals who forecast that edmonds' numbers would decline, category by category:
| AB | AVG | OBP | SLG | HR | RBI | R | |||
| decline | 1 | 2 | 7 | 11 | 3 | 1 | 0 | ||
| same | 1 | 1 | 7 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 1 | ||
| increase | 98 | 97 | 86 | 89 | 96 | 97 | 99 |
you're gonna look at that and immediately think: typical hometown forceast. that's what i thought, for sure. but then i compared our aggregate numbers against those projected by the best-regarded and -established systems, and i discovered that we're anything but pie-in-sky optimists blinded by loyalty to a declining ballplayer. on the contrary, our projection is one of the more grounded ones out there:
| AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | | | AVG | OBP | SLG | |||
| Bill James | 488 | 85 | 130 | 32 | 1 | 30 | 90 | 86 | | | .266 | .380 | .520 | ||
| ZIPS | 401 | 69 | 105 | 28 | 1 | 24 | 76 | 71 | | | .262 | .379 | .516 | ||
| Marcel | 388 | 67 | 104 | 26 | 1 | 23 | 74 | 64 | | | .268 | .372 | .518 | ||
| Shandler | 389 | 68 | 103 | 25 | 1 | 23 | 78 | 66 | | | .265 | .372 | .511 | ||
| VEB | 425 | 79 | 116 | 21 | 1 | 25 | 86 | 69 | | | .272 | .373 | .503 | ||
| CHONE | 396 | 70 | 100 | 22 | 1 | 22 | 65 | 68 | | | .253 | .365 | .480 | ||
| PECOTA | 340 | 57 | 86 | 17 | 1 | 19 | 60 | 55 | | | .253 | .357 | .476 | ||
| AVERAGE | 404 | 71 | 106 | 24 | 1 | 24 | 76 | 69 | | | .263 | .371 | .504 |
these are ranked in descending OPS order; of the 7 projections, ours is only the 5th-rosiest, and it's almost spot-on the overall averages in OBP and SLG. we project the highest number in only 1 category (batting average). with a couple of exceptions, these other handicappers agree with the vast majority of us that edmonds will improve in every major category; none sees edmonds declining from last year.
VEB community, you done good.
(by the way, i interpolated to derive the VEB totals for walks and doubles; vis-vis triples, i simply assigned edmonds 1, since that's what everybody else was projecting him for.)
VEB predicts more playing time for edmonds than all but 1 other forecaster. since the range of at-bats is so broad (james forecasts 40 percent more playing time than PECOTA does, and VEB forecasts 25 percent more), why don't we index everything to a set number of at-bats --- 400 is nice and round, and close to the average. i'll add runs created and RC/27 to the table; now we get:
| AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | | | AVG | OBP | SLG | | | RC | RC/27 | |||
| Bill James | 400 | 70 | 106 | 26 | 1 | 25 | 74 | 70 | | | .266 | .380 | .520 | | | 78 | 7.19 | ||
| ZIPS | 400 | 69 | 105 | 28 | 1 | 24 | 76 | 71 | | | .262 | .379 | .516 | | | 77 | 7.04 | ||
| Marcel | 400 | 69 | 107 | 26 | 1 | 24 | 76 | 69 | | | .268 | .372 | .518 | | | 77 | 7.11 | ||
| Shandler | 400 | 70 | 106 | 25 | 1 | 24 | 80 | 68 | | | .265 | .372 | .511 | | | 76 | 6.98 | ||
| VEB | 400 | 74 | 109 | 19 | 1 | 24 | 81 | 65 | | | .272 | .373 | .503 | | | 75 | 6.99 | ||
| CHONE | 400 | 71 | 101 | 22 | 1 | 22 | 66 | 69 | | | .253 | .365 | .480 | | | 70 | 6.29 | ||
| PECOTA | 400 | 67 | 101 | 21 | 1 | 22 | 70 | 65 | | | .253 | .357 | .476 | | | 68 | 6.14 |
that's a pretty consistent set of projections, no? give him 400 at-bats, and all parties agree that edmonds will create 68 to 78 runs --- which would make him worth an extra win or two in 2007. may the GOB make it so.
there's clearly a lot of interest in doing further community projections. i've had a couple of excellent offers from people to help out with compiling, etc., so let's push forward and see how the interest holds up. if you guys have enough stamina to project the whole lineup and (as various people suggested) come up with a VEB community pythagorean projection, i'm game for that.
however, i don't want the projections to completely take over the front page; there will be other things to talk about as spring training unfolds. so i'll do some of the projections here, and others in a diary (with a front-page pointer, so nobody misses it). later today i'll post a projection diary for one of the pitchers, and it'll stay up all weekend; i'll put up those results monday and then move forward until a) we've done the whole team, or b) y'all get sick of community projections.
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Not to toot my own horn...but
AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB AVG OBP SLG
VEB 425 79 116 21 1 25 86 69 0.272 0.373 0.503
MINE 425 77 113 21 0 24 84 72 0.265 0.375 0.485
Apparently...
Larry,
Would it benefit you if in future projections the poster listed only the numbers in the order they were requested? Making it easier to copy and paste into a spreadsheet...just a thought...i.e...
425
.272
.373
.500
25
86
79
that's a good idea
Haha!
by Jonathan23 on Feb 16, 2007 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
Pasting stuff in tabular format
Use the <code> tags. The <code> tag replaces the standard proportional font with a fixed-width (or "monospaced") font, thereby giving each individual character the same amount of screen real estate. Thus, the letter 'i', the letter 'm', and even blank spaces all occupy the same width on the screen. This allows for nice, neat tables.
Example:
WITHOUT the code tag:
AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB AVG OBP SLG
VEB 425 79 116 21 1 25 86 69 .272 .373 .503
MINE 425 77 113 21 0 24 84 72 .265 .375 .485
And now WITH the code tag bookending the data:
<code></code>
AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB AVG OBP SLG
VEB 425 79 116 21 1 25 86 69 .272 .373 .503
MINE 425 77 113 21 0 24 84 72 .265 .375 .485
Also, if formatting mistakes irk you, be sure to take advantage of the forum's "Preview" key before you Post it.
Share and enjoy!
P.S. Nice job nailing the consensus projection, cardzfanbub.
how do you enter the forward slash
HTML Posting Secrets, Part II
Oh, alright. It's not really much of a secret, anyway...just a handy HTML tidbit that's little known outside of us programmer/webmaster types or HTML acolytes.
To force the browser to actually show the less-than/greater-than symbols that are used around HTML tags, you substitute the normal typed characters by using HTML's "special character" codes.
For the others who are completely unfamiliar, HTML tags are enclosed in these: < and >. For example, surrounding your tabular data with <code> and </code> tags will change the font to preserve spacing as discussed earlier, while surrounding your text with <i> and </i> tags will make the text italic, etc.
But if I typed <code> normally in order to let you, the reader, see the HTML tag, the browser reads it as a real tag, changes the formatting accordingly, and hides the tag. So you have to "trick" the browser into displaying the <, >, and the text in between by using the "special character" codes.
If you are familiar with the ASCII table, the arcane method used to be to type the ampersand followed by the number symbol, followed by the ASCII decimal code for the desired character followed by the semicolon, thusly:
Here are some of the basic ones:
You post We see
--------- --------
& &
< <
> >
• •
™ ™
© ©
¼ ¼
½ ½
ñ ñ
But since every language has a different set of "standard" characters, this method often resulted in differing results depending upon the client PC's settings (such as the default language of the OS, etc.).
So the HTML powers-that-be came up with a uniform set of special HTML character codes that nearly all modern browsers now support. They are also MUCH easier to remember:
You post We see
--------- --------
& &
< <
> >
♠ ♠
™ ™
© ©
¼ ¼
½ ½
ñ ñ
Here's a helpful guide listing many of the ISO special HTML character codes. That webmonkey site also has a good overall HTML cheat sheet for the curious.
For the rest of you who could care less about HTML, I apologize for the long non-baseball related post, and I now feel compelled to put something in here that is clearly baseball related. Ummm...the ©ubs suck!
That is all.
i love goldstein, but his comment
I feel the same way
COME ON!
Sigh. I miss that show.
by Mr Bad Example on Feb 16, 2007 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
Right on
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/6476512?MSNHPHMA
Can you believe it? I don't care how much money they spend--the Cubs are the Cubs.
by rockin redbird on Feb 16, 2007 10:30 AM EST reply actions
And I just heard
by rockin redbird on Feb 16, 2007 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
If I were a Cubs fan...
No doubt...
by rockin redbird on Feb 16, 2007 3:10 PM EST up reply actions
Wood and Prior
I'm glad to see
Fantasy Baseball
I don't know if anyone saw this
Brad Penny
i'd love me some brad penny.... (he says in a very non-sexual way).
FANTASY BASEBALL UPDATE
VEB League #1
Roto
12 team max
yahoo default settings
live draft on March 9th (friday) at 4:30 PM (though this can still be changed) and if you can't make it you can pre-rank.
Email me at agrobe1473@earthlink.net to get the password and invite...first eleven.
by stlcardinalsfang on Feb 16, 2007 5:47 PM EST reply actions
Bennett/Marrero
My thought is the contract situation will preclude this and I can't imagine Tony will carry three catchers. So I guess he is just injury insurance?
Anyone have thoughts about the chances that Marrero could beat out Bennett?
Bennett's contract isn't the problem
This is going to be the contest I watch most carefully this spring. The pitching is going to be interesting, but I'd sure like to see Marrero catch on with the club this season.
Bennett's line last season will definitely give Eli a shot to take his job. Bennett hit .223, with a .274 OPS and .331 SLG. His defense was nothing spectacular, either, with 3 errors in 56 games(43 starts). That's nothing special, as Yadi only made 4 in 127 games.
Eli will have to show up ready to play to take the backup catching job. He has the capability to be a much better hitter than Bennett (or Molina, for that matter). It's his defense that will have to shine for him to beat out Bennett. Eli hasn't been behind the plate hardly at all in quite a while, appearing in only 13 games as a catcher since 2002. If he can still handle the glove behind the plate, he could definitely take Bennett's job.
Eli
by Yadier on Feb 16, 2007 9:53 PM EST reply actions



















