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moneyball

in case you missed it last week, cardinal stat consultant mitchel lichtman (better known as mgl) took part in a roundtable about sabermetrics at Baseball Analysts. the other two panelists were mgl's collaborator tom tango (aka tangotiger) and eric van, who now works for the boston red sox. among the many things i learned from that discussion about how mlb front offices are integrating stats into their decision-making process, the most interesting was this: the going rate for a run is $200,000; the going rate for a win is $2 million. here's the key exchange:

Mitchel: I try to counsel the Cards not to spend more than $200,000 per marginal run (on the free agent market). I consider anything less than that to be somewhat of a bargain. Less than $150,000 is a real bargain, and less than $100,000 (almost impossible) is an absolute steal

Tom: Yes, $200,000 per run or $2 million per win should be the going rate. If teams operated on that basis, they wouldn't even need a sabermetrician! . . . .

Mitchel: I do allow some leeway for elite, "top of the pyramid" players, where supply and demand really affects the market (even though it really shouldn't). But anything more than 3 or 4 million per marginal win (per year, of course) is generally a waste of money.

and that's the essence of moneyball: accurately projecting player performance, correctly pricing it, and spending with discipline. though specific stat categories (most notably OBP) often get dragged into the discussion, moneyball at bottom is about just what it says it is: money. pretty simple.

fungoes had a post on this very subject a few days ago, using a baseball prospectus stat called MORP that translates performance into dollar values. fungoes compared each cardinal player's projected 2006 MORP -- ie, the fair price for his expected performance -- with his 2006 salary, to see who looks like a bargain and who doesn't. head on over there to see the results; i will tell you that the team's highest-paid player is also its best bargain. also that all three of this off-season's main free-agent signees (rincon looper and encarnacion) appear to be subpar investments.

fungoes summed it all up in a table; i'm gonna do the same thing here, using mgl's pricing paradigm of $2m per win. before we get going, let's do a quick example from 2005 to make sure we're all down with the concept.

according to baseball prospectus' WARP (Wins Above Replacement Player), albert pujols generated about 10.7 marginal wins in 2005. at $2m per win, albert was worth $21.4 million bucks last season (ie, $2m x 10.7). the cardinals only paid $11m last year, which suggests albert was not only one of the best players in the game but also one of the biggest bargains. the cards paid him just $1m per marginal win -- half the going rate

another "wins" measurement, bill james' Win Shares, places albert's marginal wins total for 2005 at 8.3; at $2m per win, that makes him a $16.6 million player. still a huge bargain. by that measure, the cards got albert's wins at $1.3m per, a 35 percent discount.

got it? not all that complicated -- especially when you're pricing what a player has already produced. the real trick, of course, is to correctly price the production he'll deliver in the future. to do that, being lazy by nature, i'm just gonna use PECOTA --which i know a lot of you hate, and which like any player forecasting system is going to be wildly inaccurate a certain percentage of the time. but its premise is widely accepted; many major-league teams (including the cardinals) incorporate PECOTA or some version thereof into their evaluations. so just go with it for now. when the season's over and the stats are in the books, i'll revisit this post and we can all make fun of assumptions gone awry.

ready? let's begin with this off-season's free agent acquisitions, looking only at 2006. i've listed the players in descending order of price per marginal win (the far right column):

player projected
marginal wins
per PECOTA
06 salary price per
marginal win
looper 1.1 $3.5m $3.2m
rincon 0.7 $1.5m $2.1m
encarnacion 2.4 $3.5m $1.5m
bennett 0.7 $800K $1.1m
ponson 2.6 $2.5m $1m
spivey 1.7 $1.2m $700K
cruz 1.3 $800K $600K
TOTAL 10.5 $13.8m $1.3m

the cardinals heeded mgl's advice this off-season. they only significantly exceeded the $2m-per-win dictum for one player, braden looper -- and given the inflated market for relievers, it would have been difficult to hold the line there. of course, three of these contracts were multiyear deals and should really be evaluated as such. over the life of those deals, what did the cardinals pay per projected marginal win?

player projected
marginal wins
per PECOTA
contract value price per
marginal win
looper 2.8 $13.5m $4.8m
encarnacion 5.8 $15m $2.6m
rincon 1.4 $2.9m $2.1m
TOTAL 10 $31.4m $3.1m

ugh. now the looper signing looks truly disastrous -- and that's not my opinion, i'm simply applying the standards the cards' own consultant uses. they also overpaid for encarnacion, and although the premium is not a crippling one over the life of the deal, years 2 and 3 will be killers -- they'll be paying $3.5m per marginal win those years, nearly twice the going rate.

what about some of the deals the cardinals didn't make?

player projected
marginal wins
per PECOTA
contract value price per
marginal win
burnett 22 $55m $2.5m
grud'k 3.3 $6m $1.8m
sanders 2.7 $10m $3.7m
tavarez 3.0 $6.7m $2.2m
nunez 2.8 $3.4m $1.2m
mabry 0.9 $1m $1.1m

comments: first, PECOTA projects reggie sanders as a terrible buy; the cards probably had similar projections of his performance and stayed away for that reason. grudzielanek wasn't a bad buy at all, hence jocketty's reported willingness to meet his price (ownership allegedly vetoed that deal). no loss, though, as spivey -- at least per PECOTA, pre-alarmingly-bad-spring-training -- projects to be a better bargain. the cards could never have signed tavarez at the price he eventually settled for; you'll recall he was seeking a four-year deal until well into january, when he finally realized the market wasn't there -- and by then the cards' deadline for re-signing him had passed.

finally we come to burnett. they could have gotten him for $2.5m per marginal win -- a slight premium, but no worse than what they paid for encarnacion. as i've repeated way too many times, it might have made more sense to pay the premium for a potential difference maker like burnett, as opposed to paying the same premium for a spaceholder like encarnacion.

in case you didn't know i felt that way.

here's a table with info for the whole team -- well, most of it anyway. remember, mgl's $2m-per-marginal-win thing applies only to the free-agent market; the younger players who haven't yet become free-agent eligible shouldn't really be judged by that standard. but what the hell, it's my blog. i've thrown in a few extra columns of data just for fun. the players are listed in descending order of projected marginal wins:

player projected
marginal wins
per PECOTA
projected
value at
$2m per win
06 salary projected
profit/loss
price per
marginal win
pujols 9.3 $18.6m $14m $4.6m $1.5m
edmonds 6.9 $13.8m $12m $1.8m $1.7m
carpenter 6.8 $13.6m $5m $8.6m $750K
suppan 4.1 $8.2m $4m $4.2m $1m
mulder 4.1 $8.2m $7.5m $700K $1.8m
rolen 4.1 $8.2m $11m -$2.8m $2.7m
eckstein 3.4 $6.8m $3.5m $3.3m $1m
marquis 3.2 $6.4m $5.1m $1.3m $1.6m
yadi 2.8 $5.6m $350K $5.3m $125K
j-rod 2.8 $5.6m $350K $5.3m $125K
ponson 2.6 $5.2m $2.5m $2.7m $1m
isringhausen 2.6 $5.2m $8m -$2.8m $3m
encarnacion 2.4 $4.8m $3.5m $1.3m $1.5m
bigbie 1.9 $3.8m $900K $2.9m $500K
luna 1.8 $3.6m $320K $3.3m $170K
spivey 1.7 $3.4m $1.2m $2.2m $700K
thompson 1.4 $2.8m $350K $2.5m $250K
cruz 1.3 $2.6m $800K $1.8m $600K
looper 1.1 $2.2m $3.5m -$1.3m $3.2m
flores 0.9 $1.8m $350K $1.45m $380K
taguchi 0.9 $1.8m ~$800K $1m $900K
rincon 0.7 $1.4m $1.5m -$100K $2.1m
bennett 0.7 $1.4m $800K $600K $1.1m

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Interesting stuff!
The one thing I don't fully get is Izzy being overpriced. I suppose it's pretty much the same for all closers. How does marginal wins in PECOTA work for them? 90% of the time they come on in a situation where they can only hold on to a win or lose.

I went into his value for money recently and declared that he comes pretty much at the going price for a good, experienced closer.

by Neuronix on Mar 16, 2006 8:56 AM EST   0 recs

Carp
more evidence (as if we needed any) that Walt made a brilliant move locking him up w/that extension.

by DCRedbird on Mar 16, 2006 9:03 AM EST   0 recs

Izzie
Yet more evidence -- if any more was needed --  that izzie needs to be traded while he still can be traded.  Of course he's a good player, but a team like the cardinals simply can't afford him.  If the birds weren't saddled with izzie's salary maybe they'd have been able to acquire the stopper they so desperately need.  Or maybe they wouldn't have been suckered into signing encarnacion.

It's time for cardinals fans to lose their (understandable) emotional attachment to izzie and move on.

by lerwin1 on Mar 16, 2006 9:32 AM EST   0 recs

What do other closers make?
I'd like to see a list of what they make/year.

by sdrone on Mar 16, 2006 9:57 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

closers
fungoes had a post on this a while back using win shares.  

http://fungoes.blogspot.com/2005/11/cards-and-moneyball-closer.html

unfortunately there are a lot closers on the list that were FA so their salary really changes things.  i dont think they should be considered.  i'm also not a big fan of win shares.  i understand what it is trying to calculate, i just think it doesnt do a very good job of it.  call izzy overpaid if you want.  he probably is, but i think we are better off overpaying him than going with some schmuck like tyler walker, reitsma or weathers.  moneyball works nice if you can find golden arms like turnbow on the scrap heap but there are no guarantees there.

by dmb60614 on Mar 16, 2006 10:31 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

edit
that should say closers that werent free agents.  one of these days i'll learn how to spell check.

by dmb60614 on Mar 16, 2006 10:33 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

he's still worth it
we've seen what happens when guys like brantley or veres close.  we've seen what happens to the pen when izzy gets injured.  perhaps the cards could have stuck calero at closer, but he isnt around anymore.  i'd rather give izzy a million or two extra then have to go through the season with a garbage closer or cbc.  the quazi moneyball boston redsox tried to go with a bargain closer/cbc and failed miserably.  

by dmb60614 on Mar 16, 2006 10:25 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

LaRussa Loves Izzy
I heard LaRussa say, time and again, that he's coached teams with effective closers and without, and he likes coaching with an effective closer way better.  

I don't know where the animus against Izzy comes from.  Sure, he makes your stomach acid boil, but the guy gets the job done time and again.  If you're going to pay a premium for peace of mind, the closer's the place to do it.  I think that's LaRussa's point, and I agree with it.

In any event, remember game 5 of the NLCS?  Pujols hits a world-class dinger to bring the Cards back from the brink, instantly deflating the fifth largest metropolis in the nation.  Even after that, Izzy still had to go out there and bring home the bottom of the Ninth.  And he did.

There are fewer than 5 people I would trust in that situation, and one of those five is the fella who got bent over by Pujols in the top half of the inning.

Overpaying?  No way.

So says, The Dude

by Titus Pullo on Mar 16, 2006 11:26 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

Don't forget
Izzy pitched a scoreless 8th inning in that game, too.

by flynn on Mar 16, 2006 12:42 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Projecting over a contract
Good analysis, but since many players have backloaded contracts you can't project over the lifetime of a deal without also increasing the average cost of a win. I'd reckon that, by the third year of Encarnacion's deal, his $2.6m/win will be close to the average. (Looper will always be overpaid.)

by Hastur on Mar 16, 2006 9:43 AM EST   0 recs

but by the third year
he'll be owed $6.5m, and his current PECOTA projection (for what little it's worth) is for just 1.4 marginal wins that season --- which means he's projected to make $4.5m per marginal win in 2008. inflation won't be that steep.

by lboros on Mar 16, 2006 11:25 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

rationality
it's somewhat reassuring to hear that there's a rational approach to FAs.

One thing a system like that leaves out is the ticket sale value. Signing a star FA can bring in extra ticket sales from the fence sitters...the issue doesn't really apply for St Louis given that they've sold out already, but generating extra revenue from ticket sales and the other $$ venues where a star player can have an impact reduces his cost to some degree.

but it is nice to see solid rationale behind decisions like that, and the Cards as a team are a good example of the "third way," a moderate approach combining moneyball and the so-called traditional way. as a Cards fan I often feel a little left out of that silly debate because, duh, there's merit in a meeting of both approaches.

by VanRam on Mar 16, 2006 9:52 AM EST   0 recs

Awesome post lboros
I don't necessarily understand all the stats, but as I read it I was asking questions and your last table answered them.

so how does this tie into payroll?  If a win costs $2m, does this mean payroll should be, for instance, $200m?

by sdrone on Mar 16, 2006 9:59 AM EST   0 recs

I think the answer to that is...
only if you have average financial disciple.  Of course the name of the game now is Moneyball or using the dollars effectively.  So while on average a win may cost $2 million dollars, its not an effective strategy to just make average signings unless you are the Yankess or Red Sox and can afford a $200 million team.

Also as I understand the $2 million figure doesn't take into account younger guys not eligible for FA yet.  So likely the $2 million dollar is a bit overinflated if you look at total baseball salaries and divide by 2430 (the number of games in a season or 162*30/2)  

by Zubin on Mar 16, 2006 11:26 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

thanks sdrone
don't forget, $2m per marginal win only applies to free agents; you pay less per marg win for younger players. that's why you can't say that it takes a $200m payroll to build a 100-win team.

think of it like this: a team with 25 minimum-wage guys (ie, this year's florida marlins) would have a payroll of $8.3 million and would be expected to win about 45 to 50 games. if you were a really sharp, disciplined, and lucky free-agent shopper, you could replace all those guys on the free-agent market and buy 45 marginal wins --- ie, the wins over and above what the minimum-wage guys would get you --- to reach the 90-95 win level. at $2m per marginal win, you'd have a payroll of about $90m --- ie, about the cardinals' payroll.

all good in theory.

the reality is that teams mix-match guys at varying price points. they overpay for some, underpay for others, and it all comes out in the wash.

by lboros on Mar 16, 2006 11:33 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

Chemistry
So, I guess people attribute the Cards winning two hundred games the last couple years at just under a million per win with Jocketty's genius?

Moneyball talks about how closers are over priced for their value in wins.  While this is always true, you need a strong closer for the playoffs...IMO.  I feel the same way about starting pitching, Burnett is a lesser bargain than Suppan, but that doesn't mean the Cards wouldn't be better off with Burnett.  The best valued team (most efficient BUSINESS) doesn't make the best baseball team.  Oakland has a solid team, but they would need a lot of luck to win a world series this year.  The Yankees probably have a terrible team value wise, but are always a threat to go all the way.  Same with the Red Sox.  

Moneyball makes a statement at one point that if baseball were like any other business, then Oakland would have absorbed all the other teams and would have a baseball monopoly.  I think your post (a great one to read) demonstrates that the Cardinals will be right there with them.

Now if we could only get them to draft so many high school players that never see the bigs!

by Toddius396 on Mar 16, 2006 11:29 AM EST   0 recs

Marginal wins
Remember that the $2mil/win figure is just for wins OVER AND ABOVE what could be expected from a team of "replacement-level-players"; that's the definition of "marginal wins."

So we can assume that a replacement-level team would win about 54 games (slightly worse than KC did last year), and would pay its players the minimum (+/- $325K each, or $8.1 million.

In order to be a contender, you'd have to win around 90 games, so those extra 36 wins to get from 54 to 90 become your "marginal wins," and at a cost of $2million per, that's $72 mil, for a total salary of $80 million. And that's with good efficiency; as we know, teams aren't that efficient, and many have a lot of underperforming dead weight on the roster.

One of the biggest wastes is paying much more than the minimum to flesh out your bench, or the back of the bullpen---there is bench-ready talent out there if you know how to find it, and to pay ANY second-string catcher or fifth infielder or 12th pitcher $1million is poor (or lazy) management.

by salvomania on Mar 16, 2006 12:05 PM EST   0 recs

Fascinating post
What it says, I think, is that the Cardinals really overpaid for just one player on a market-adjusted basis: Rincon. I think you can argue that Rolen brings an awful lot to the table leadership-wise, even if he's a touch expensive. As for Isringhausen, I think we all remember what happened when he got injured last spring.

On the flip-side, letting Sanders and Tavarez go were strong moves, while letting Grudzie go was probably a mistake--as we are now seeing from his designee's poor spring performance. Oh, and dropping Burnett wasn't such a bad move after all.

Lboros--

I wonder if you could play what-if with a few FA's and see who shouldabeen a Cardinal. Ditto for Matt Morris, though I think GIGO applies...

by Red in Chicago on Mar 16, 2006 12:09 PM EST   0 recs

Dollar Value of Players
Here's another interesting THT series on the Dollar Value of Players.  The series demonstrates how marginal win values vary among different franchises.  So, the value of a good ballplayer concurrently varies from franchise to franchise.

While this further complicates matters, I think it helps explain why the Yankees or Red Sox seemingly overpay for FAs --- their marginal win values (in terms of ticket sales, etc.) are such that what they pay may actually be worth it.

 

matty fred is a web log.

by matty fred on Mar 16, 2006 12:31 PM EST   0 recs

The other thing that this analysis shows
is that A-Rod is probably not all that overpaid, particularly if you count him as a SS and not a 3B.  He averages about 10 wins above replacement, and you get $2.5M per marginal win, which, considering that the player you're paying for is a perennial MVP candidate (or alternately, you're getting all those wins in one lump sum, rather than 2 wins each spread out over five players), and that seems to be about in line with this analysis.

This, of course, ignores the fact that paying $25M to one guy makes it a lot harder to find cash to fill the 24 other slots.

by Valatan on Mar 16, 2006 4:30 PM EST   0 recs

A-Rod at $16mil per
According to this (http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2005/01/new-york-yankees_111398168678860040.html), the Yankees are only paying A-Rod $112mil over 7 years, or an average of $16mil per season.  That makes for an even better $1.6M per marginal win.  Then again, since this system is all about FA's, can you count a guy that was a trade aquisition?  He's working under a contract that was signed by a FA, but the terms have essentially changed thanks to the trade.

To me, these are some of the best players to have.  Guys that signed large contracts somewhere and then didn't work out there for some reason, but are still valuable players.  The team that has them is often under tremendous pressue to unload the player, and will do so at a large loss.  See Walker, Larry, Renteria, Edgar, and Rod, A-.

by john vb on Mar 16, 2006 5:13 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

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