rate the rotations

by lboros on Dec 13, 2006 3:28 PM EST in St. Louis Cardinals News

just a quick post to hold the space today ---

with the pickings getting slim on the f.a. market, which nl teams have the best starting rotations (on paper)? where do the cardinals rate? and who can the cardinals realistically acquire to crack the top 1/4 of the league?

back tomorrow with a full-length post . . . .

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Dodgers are out in front...

by a long shot. Padres are most likely in second if Hensley does well and they re-sign Wells. I'd say Cardinals are in the middle of the pack, with the possibility of being top of the pack but also the possibility of dropping to bottom of the pack. All depends on how Reyes/Wainwright/Wells are able to perform, and who our last SP is.

Miller sucks.

by Ankiels Missing Curveball on Dec 13, 2006 3:31 PM EST reply actions

herr managing

Not on topic but Tommy Herr got hired by the Nats to manage their single A team today. As a child of the 80's it pleases me.

by mcpawlowicz on Dec 13, 2006 3:32 PM EST reply actions

Cards rotation

The strategy is clearly to hold back bucks until Carlos Zambrano becomes available next year and then lose out to the Royals in the bidding.

by carys on Dec 13, 2006 3:32 PM EST reply actions

i'll take the padres

peavy, young, maddux, and hensley. i'd rate the marlins 2d --- willis, olsen, johnson, sanchez, and nolasco.

by lboros on Dec 13, 2006 3:32 PM EST reply actions

Oddly, so far so good

In spite of our openings, I still feel better about where we are than I did last year at this time. We'll fill the slots we have open, and our rotation will be better than last year.

So far, Houston's rotation has gotten worse than last year's, and well, the Cubs are the Cubs, except now they pay their mediocre players more to lose.

Who's got the best rotation in the NL? I'm not sure. But we are holding our own in the NL Central, even with potentially 2 spots to fill.

BTW, Marquis's ZiPS numbers are out:

2007 ZiPS Projection - Jason Marquis
-------------------------------------------------------------
W L G GS IP H ER HR BB SO ERA
-------------------------------------------------------------
Projection 11 15 31 31 191 203 105 31 70 111 4.95
2008 10 15 30 30 184 195 102 31 68 110 4.99
2009 9 15 29 29 175 185 99 31 66 107 5.09
-------------------------------------------------------------
Opt. (15%) 15 14 34 34 216 213 98 29 68 130 4.08
Pes. (15%) 6 16 26 26 153 180 111 37 66 90 6.53
--------------------------------------------------------------

Pretty funny if you ask me.

by glamberson on Dec 13, 2006 3:34 PM EST reply actions

Not as funny as

the comments Dan posted with his projections (which I posted in the last thread). Hysterical...especially the part about Zimmer.

by RedbirdRay on Dec 13, 2006 3:52 PM EST up reply actions

Rotations (on paper)

Cards
Brewers
Reds
Cubs
Astros (without Clemens)
Pirates

Here Comes the King! Here Comes the Big #1! Budweiser Beer the King is Second to None!

by OKCardsfan on Dec 13, 2006 3:41 PM EST reply actions

Padres rate the best, with Phillies, Cubs and LA

potentially right there.

Cole Hamels, Bretty Myers and Freddy Garcia could all win 15 or so games. Same for Carlos Zambrano, Mark Prior (if healthy) and Ted Lilly. Rich Hill looked decent, too. Dodgers have good depth and maybe they have the best all around staff now. If they trade Penny, I think the Padres top them for sure.

by michajo on Dec 13, 2006 3:45 PM EST reply actions

What about the Marlins?

The Marlins rotation is definitely not in the top spot in the NL. I believe the Dodgers are first, the Padres #2. But the Marlins rotation, although chock-full of rookies, did pretty well last year and should be a force to be reckoned with as the young guys keep progressing.

"What was my favorite championship? The next one." - Tom Brady

by Hot in Herr on Dec 13, 2006 3:46 PM EST reply actions

The Marlins were

second in VORP and SNLVAR last year, didn't lose anyone and will only get better with age. Very tough and deep rotation, IMO.

by RedbirdRay on Dec 13, 2006 3:54 PM EST up reply actions

Their Rotation as it Stands...

Willis
Olsen
Johnson
Nolasco
Sanchez

They stuck to their guns and didn't trade away anyone in the offseason (so far). Johnson and Olsen have decent K/9's. All of these guys won at least 10 games last year and Sanchez only started 17 games (13 QS's, too). If you put that rotation in front of a good defense, the Marlins have a great chance to compete against the rest of the big payrolls in the NL East.

"What was my favorite championship? The next one." - Tom Brady

by Hot in Herr on Dec 13, 2006 4:44 PM EST up reply actions

The caveat there is

"as the young guys keep progressing" should be an if. There's no guarantee that some of those starters don't take some steps backwards as they are seen by hitters more and more. That's a really promising pack of pitchers but I think some may regress next year.

What's scary is that the Marlins have a purty little stockpile of arms in the high minors too. They made out like bandits in some of those trades last firesale.

by azruavatar on Dec 13, 2006 6:20 PM EST up reply actions

As far as who we can realistically acquire

...Barry Zito is the only name remaining that pushes us up a notch in terms of our pitching. We can debate whether or not it is realistic for us to acquire him (years), but we appear to have the cash there to do so. I doubt we could land a better pitcher during the season, so I'd go after him. Add him to a rotation of Carp/Reyes/Wells/Wainwright(?) and you've got a rotation that competes with any other in the league for top honors.

As things stand now, I like the Marlins, Padres, and Phillies for tops.

by PhatAlbert on Dec 13, 2006 4:26 PM EST reply actions

Dodgers

Don't the Dodgers have 8 ligit starting pitchers now? Over the course of the season likely they will have the best pitching. That doesn't mean they have the best 1-2 punch for the post-season.

by Zubin on Dec 13, 2006 4:44 PM EST reply actions

just in our division

The Pirates rotation is pretty under rated. They have some pretty good young arms in Duke, Snell, Gorzellany and Maholm. They were a big part of why the Pirates won 37 games after the break.

"Go Crazy, Folks! Go Crazy!"

by erik on Dec 13, 2006 6:12 PM EST reply actions

Huh????

The Cards have one great pitcher, a guy who is almost still a rookie, a guy who hasn't had a decent season in 3 years and another guy who might still be in the bullpen. How can we even rank this? This is an A, D, I, I, W if it were on a report card. (I is incomplete, W is withdrawn) I am still optimistic, but at this point, your rotation only has one proven commodity. The Astros, Reds, Brewers, Cubs and Pirates all are better right now. (Or at least those last 4.) We may climb the ladder a little with a decent signing or trade, but what we have now is a rotation that I wouldn't confidently project a winning record from anyone but Carp.

How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!

by Elvis on Dec 13, 2006 7:04 PM EST reply actions

Zito

I've got 2 words for you...No Chance!. Scott Boras is asking for a 100 year contract for 9 billion dollars and an autographed picture of Sherman Helmsley for this guy. More importantly, Zito wants to be a movie star when he is done with baseball and has made it clear that LA, NY, or Chicago are his preferred destinations.

Try Weaver, Mulder and Piniero...my 2 cents.

How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!

by Elvis on Dec 13, 2006 7:09 PM EST reply actions

NL Rotations

I like the depth and experience of the Dodgers and Phillies. The Padres and Braves should have solid five man rotations as well. The Marlins have the most potential, but I expect a couple of their young pitchers to struggle with another year of exposure.

The Cardinals are in the bottom half by my account. Carpenter is the only proven league average pitcher or better. Reyes and Wainwright should be with their minor league track records, but I'd feel a lot more secure with a Jeff Suppan in the mix and another "project" as insurance against the rooks and Kip Wells horrible track record.

All my friends became Cardinal fans and grew up happy and liberal. I became a Cub fan and grew up imbittered and conservative." -- George Will

by wannabeGedman on Dec 13, 2006 10:33 PM EST reply actions