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considering bigbie

did some digging around in larry bigbie's batting records, just to get a feel for the guy. he played college at ball state (not far from his hometown of hobart, indiana) and was baltimore's 1st-round pick (21st overall) in the 1999 amateur draft. moved up to class-a ball that summer, ended 2000 at double-a, and by 2001 was on the o's roster, hitting .229 in 131 at-bats. he spent most of 2002 at triple-a rochester and started 2003 at triple-a ottawa; was recalled on april 24 and made 18 starts in the outfield, then went onto the dl with a shoulder strain on may 21. his line at the time: an anemic .239 / .316 / .328 / .644.

he came back in late july and finally showed what he could do. starting nearly every day over the last two months of 2003, bigbie (then 25) hit .323 with 8 homers and 26 rbi. he took some good pitchers deep, too -- david wells, kevin foulke, kelvim escobar, jeff weaver -- and continued to hit as an everyday player in 2004. from july 2003 through the end of 2004 (nearly 800 plate appearances) he posted a .294 / .353 / .448 / .802 line. the cards' high hopes for bigbie are based in large part upon this season-and-a-half stretch.

he was probably not healthy at the outset of 2005; in late may, sporting a .541 ops in 112 at-bats, he went onto the dl. in his first two games back he went 6 for 7 and hit his 1st hr of the year (a solo shot against houston's brandon backe). he added another 3-hit game two weeks later against the yankees and carl pavano. those three games -- in which he went 9 for 11 with 2 homers -- rehabilitated his stat line; by july 1 he'd pulled his avg up to .266 and his ops to .732. . . . . but he hit .185 in july, got traded to the rockies and didn't perform, which got him benched; from mid-august through the end of the year he got only 8 at-bats and struck out in 6 of them.

so we can write off bigbie's unsightly 2005 line in part to injury and inactivity. but if we allow for those mitigations, then we are also obliged to note that bigbie padded his 2004 line by victimizing terrible pitchers. he hit 3 of his 15 homers that year off guys who threw fewer than 5 innings in the majors in 2004 (bobby jones, ryan snare, and joe beimel); another two came against guys (ryan glynn, mark bascik) who threw fewer than 20 innings that season. so fully 1/3 of his homers came against hurlers who fell way, way below replacement level. of the 15 taters, 11 were served up by pitchers sporting eras of 4.50 or higher, and half by pitchers with eras of 5.00 and up. that trend continued in 2005, when bigbie's 5 homers came off brandon backe (4.76 era), kyle davies (4.93), carl pavano (4.77), seth mcclung (6.59), and chien-ming wang (4.02).

we are also obliged to acknowledge that bigbie has some health issues. he has gone onto the dl three years in a row -- for a shoulder thing in 2003, a groin pull in 2004, and an unspecified malady last season.

off the toppamine head, i can only think of one former 1st-round pick who scuffled as bigbie has but finally broke through. that would be jeff king, the 1st overall pick in 1986. through bigbie's current age (27) he was burdened with a .660 career ops, but king broke through at age 28, hitting .295 w a .762 ops and 98 rbi. from that year forward through his retirement in 1999, king posted a .782 ops -- .340 obp, .442 slg.

if bigbie can post comparable numbers card'l fans would be mightily satisfied -- even if much of the damage comes against double- and triple-a caliber pitching. there's plenty of that in this league. good luck to ya kid.

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goofy Cubs
over at mlbtraderumors, there's a post about them being in talks with Preston Wilson.  I guess the Tejada deal is dead and this is what they are hoping to supplement it with?  The cubs are funny!  Piss off one of thier top of the rotation pitchers with trade talks and the add another J. Jones (see strike outs!) to play oppisite of him.  

by FarCards on Dec 29, 2005 9:14 AM EST reply actions  

I wouldn't
call getting Preston Wilson goofy. He was one of the FA OF's I was hoping the Cardinals would acquire. He's a better hitter then Jones & Juan E.
http://www.playahard9.blogspot.com/

by erik on Dec 29, 2005 10:24 AM EST up reply actions  

Hitting Homer off of Subpar Pitching
In the interest of fairness, what are the home run percentages of, say, a Jimmy Edmonds or Reggie Sanders when broken down the way you have Larry Bigbie (according to pitchers in ERA groupings and by number of big league innings recorded)? Is there a site that has such a statistical listing? I think that such information would better put into perspective what we should expect from Bigbie.

by bgh on Dec 29, 2005 9:17 AM EST reply actions  

Based on those stats
I was willing to hand Bigbie right field in spring training and see what he can do with it.  Esp. if he'd good defensively.   Heh, unfortunately we acquired Juancion...

by sdrone on Dec 29, 2005 9:29 AM EST reply actions  

Wilson
would have been nice, but do we need all those SO behing Jimmy..ouch

by punchinjudy on Dec 29, 2005 11:06 AM EST reply actions  

Give him a chance....
I am believer in that a players mood can have a big effect on their performance.  That said, I know Bigbie was unhappy about being traded to Colorado.  He had spent his entire career with Baltimore.  Bigbie sounds very happy to be in St. Louis, to be with a contender, to be closer to his hometown.  I think all this will factor in to a pretty decent outfielder for us.
Plus, and this is completely irrelevant, but I had Bigbie  
Freezing in Wisconsin.

by WiscCard on Dec 29, 2005 11:09 AM EST reply actions  

Sorry...continued....
on my STL team on MVP Baseball 2005 and he ended up hitting .285 for the season.
Freezing in Wisconsin.

by WiscCard on Dec 29, 2005 11:09 AM EST up reply actions  

Based on these stats...
We need him.  As long as he can hit journeymen and sub-par pitching as we seem to take those nights off.
How does he hit against soft-tossing lefthanders just called up from AAA?

by jroman on Dec 29, 2005 11:14 AM EST reply actions  

good post, lb
This gives me some hope for Bigbie as a full-time guy in LF. Based on his comments since the trade, he seems convinced that consistent playing time is all he needs to meet his potential... of course everyone says that, but in his case it just might be true.

That said, I hope there's a legit contest in spring training b/w Bigbie and J-Rod, who is apparently mashing in winter ball. (Latest stats: 65 ab/.354/.443/.708; 1.151 OPS; 6hr, 23 rbis, 11/10 bb/K) I think we were all impressed by the quality ABs J-Rod had in the NLCS against some of Houston's best pitchers. Now if he could just learn how to run the damn bases...

Is it too much to hope that one of these two guys can give us .285/.350/.450/15hr/75rbi as a full-timer? At their salaries, I think we'd all be rather pleased w/that.

by DCRedbird on Dec 29, 2005 12:19 PM EST reply actions  

What about Suppan
Considering the pitching market and the fact that we will have one solidified contract, Carp, nailed down for 2007...I would love to see Suppan signed for the bargain we have had the past 3 years.  What you see is what you get, but his numbers have far exceeded the expectations for an average salary of 3 mil.  He is only 30, a known commodity, and has been one of our most reliable pitchers in the post-season.

by koopster on Dec 29, 2005 12:41 PM EST reply actions  

Before everyone
gives up on Biggbie..Id like to remind everyone that J-rod who now everyone likes was also found up on the scrap heap.  So I like the post about seeing them duke it out in ST. I would also like to see mulder signed..sorry i know alot of you guys hate him

by punchinjudy on Dec 29, 2005 1:39 PM EST reply actions  

Mulder
I would like to see him signed now, instead of next offseason when he could get a lot more $$$.  I agree with you that a lot of people here do not like him (I am on the fence), but you cannot argue with results (97-50, 3.87 ERA, 116 ERA+).  

Not to sound hypocritical, but if he does not want an extention now and if he could be traded for a quality player(s), something like the highly unlikely Tejada/Bedard deal, I would make that deal in an instant.  

by Just Rope Ball on Dec 29, 2005 2:29 PM EST up reply actions  

It's not
so much that folks hate him--just that he was trumpeted as being our next ace, was paid and traded for like an ace, but then never filled the role. As a #3--with occasional flashes of brilliance--he's fine. I agree we should lock him down, though. He's dependable enough on the whole (as long as no postseason series rests entirely on him). Still, I would trade him for Tejada/Bedard too.

by rockin redbird on Dec 29, 2005 3:15 PM EST up reply actions  

i agree
that he should be signed now, if he's not i dont' see them getting a deal done...He's a left starter..people over pay for those..see some 41 year old named Randy Johnson...id give him a 2 year deal with a 3rd yr option

by punchinjudy on Dec 29, 2005 3:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Bigbie/JRod
I believe that J-Rod, if he stayed healthy/fresh for an entire season, could put up some pretty decent numbers. Once he completely adjusts to major league pitching he could be another of those diamond-in-the-rough kind of guys. Bigbie, on the other hand, while I don't think he will be terrible, I just don't think he'll be very good either. As a 4th outfielder I wouldn't mind him. I'd rather see J-Rod get the first shot at the job, then when he starts to wear down from the strain of the season, give Bigbie a chance.

One thing I will say about Bigbie, you gotta love his attitude and enthusiasum about becoming a Card.

by CougarCard on Dec 29, 2005 2:04 PM EST reply actions  

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